Navigation: Jump to content areas:


Pro Quality. Fan Perspective.
Login-facebook
Around SBN: The Infuriating Jose Molina

Joe Johnson Buys and Owns the Outcome

It's hard to say the same thing over and over, but once again the Hawks offense came off the tracks late in a game, and their defense played too sporadically to overtake a steady Milwaukee Bucks team at their place, losing 98-95.

To accomplish the feat, the Hawks had to lose another decent lead in the fourth quarter, due in large part to missed free throws (2 from Al Horford, 1 from Josh Smith), poor defense, and another Joe Johnson takeover of the game in the fourth quarter.

Star-divide

First, credit where credit is due---just because the Hawks left Luke Ridnour, John Salmons, and Carlos Delfino open so many times doesn't automatically mean they make those shots. They combined for a 9-18 three point shooting extravaganza to help overcome a 52-45 percent shooting deficit against the Hawks.

And when he wasn't scoring from the outside, Salmons was wearing out Josh Smith going to the basket. The Bucks looked for that switch often in the second half, where Salmons scored (25) of his (32) points. When the Hawks tried to clamp his scoring, it usually left Delfino or Ridnour open for their shooting business.

Still, the Hawks were able to maintain control despite the rally and was trading baskets with the home team behind Josh Smith re-discovering that jump shots are not how he made a leap forward this year and Joe Johnson taking advantage of every single defender that MIL threw at him.

Then, with a minute and a half left in the game, the Hawks scored their final points. Johnson backed down another smaller defender and shot over them inside. After another Josh Smith foul attempting to defend Salmons and the subsequent free throws, Johnson found himself considerably further out than his previous possession, but did not allow the significant increase in the degree of difficulty deter him from firing a twenty-something foot fallaway without even thinking about passing the ball. It missed.

Johnson compounded the misfire by becoming Mario West at midcourt, overplaying Salmons to the point of grabbing him and picking up a foul with (12) seconds left. We can debate whether Dick Bavetta should have called it, but Johnson didn't need to be pushing the envelope at that particular point in the game, especially at that place on the floor. All it did was highlight that not even Joe Johnson was convinced that he alone could keep Salmons from getting to the hoop again.

After Salmons put the Bucks up two with his free throws, Johnson again dribbled what was left of the clock down to the nub, forcing another shot and missing, sealing his team's fate.

Johnson took (11) of the team's last (16) shots, Jamal Crawford's last second attempt included. He was hot, for sure, but the team doesn't need to engage in Joe-only fourth quarters as they did in 2005-2006. The Hawks have been very successful moving the ball through all sort of skill sets in games versus have Joe try to win games for ATL.  I am not buying Johnson's post game press comments that the team looks to him to do this kind of late game hijackery of the ball.

Consider:

Al Horford did a great job closing the game the night before against San Antonio and Tim Duncan but is suddenly a wallflower, getting (and making) only (5) shots against a slower Milwaukee front line?

Josh Smith has been very effective late in games, both in the high post and low post, evidenced by his own back to back buckets in this very same fourth quarter, only temporarily breaking Johnson's hold on the quarter. The only times he is not effective late is when Joe is isolating and Smith ends up wide open in the corner and missing a jump shot.

Jamal Crawford has been good as well late in games, often mirroring Johnson's own touch for getting tough baskets when defenses are able to bog down the ATL offense.

Again I'll say it---Joe was feeling it, which might have empowered the whole "take the game over" mentality. But there were equally times in the game when Jamal, Josh, or Horford was hot and didn't stop Johnson from vetoing their "feed him and fan him" runs by controlling the ball himself and deciding it was time for him to shoot, electing to end such hot streaks.

Perhaps this is an issue that is native to great players like Joe---the talent and associated ego that serves to bring so much on behalf of the team can lend itself to such outcomes. Joe decided that he was hot and effective enough to decide the game on his own. He purchased this with his status and role on the team and, in turned, owned the outcome, win or lose.

I don't feel this is necessary, but until something changes, there will be games like this where even though there are equally (or more) effective means of getting fourth quarter buckets, the price of having a player of Johnson's status is that those options are subject to being muted in the shadow of Johnson's attempts to try and make plays on his own.

Highlights:


Comment 86 comments  |  0 recs  | 

Do you like this story?

Comments

Display:

Really what's the difference on any other team?

I’ve heard it time and time again from commentators. You want the ball in the hand of your “superstar” in crunch time and you’ll live with the results. Around the league, there’s Iso-LeBron, Iso-Kobe, Iso-Pierce, Iso-Bosh. You get my point. If he’d made that last floater, we’d be celebrating. He didn’t so now we’re back to sulking. It happens. That’s their style of ball. I’m not saying it’s right, but it is what it is.

Bet it hit the rim!

by dstdeelite on Mar 23, 2010 9:25 AM EDT reply actions  

The problem is

Joe is not a “superstar” and we have other, often more capable shooters/scorers

by The Beard on Mar 23, 2010 9:42 AM EDT up reply actions  

"not an Superstar"

Can we really use the superstar argument for this game?? What Joe Johnson did in the fourth quarter was just amazing. Reminded me of the other big time players in the league. He did everything…….back people down, hit the floater in the lane, hit the jumper he was nearly unstoppable. If it was Kobe or LeBron the same thing would have happened. Everyone says Joe is to passive well last night was not one of those times. He was trying to carry his team to victory. The bottom line is you win some you lose some, or better yet you hit the shot or you miss the shot. It happens to the best of them.

by Nick Shields on Mar 23, 2010 9:57 AM EDT up reply actions  

So did John Salmons

would you call him a superstar…I didn’t think so

by The Beard on Mar 23, 2010 10:06 AM EDT up reply actions  

Look, I love Joe

but we need to be realistic about his limitations. He is not always our best scoring option anymore. He needs to focus on having more 13 assist games and fewer 25 pt games

by The Beard on Mar 23, 2010 10:07 AM EDT up reply actions  

I agree.

I’ve watched Lebron, it seems Lebron racks up the assists first. Then focuses on scoring. Or Lebron sees what his team needs and provides that most of the time. Same for Wade and Kobe. But these three have fallen short a few times. They are just more consistent than JJ. They are just much smarter decision makers. JJ needs to figure out what the team needs at that time then try to provide it. Yesterday the team didn’t need him to take over on offense like that.

by DPhenomenal1 on Mar 23, 2010 11:17 AM EDT up reply actions  

You're right

Joe doesn’t get the publicity that the so called superstars get. Joe doesn’t even get “superstar calls/treatment”.

by DPhenomenal1 on Mar 23, 2010 11:06 AM EDT up reply actions  

At the end of a game, I'll agree...

but Horford only having 5 shots all game is a problem. Last shot we’ve got no argument, it’s just the earlier 47 minutes I disagree with.

by Mr. Sanchez on Mar 23, 2010 10:21 AM EDT up reply actions  

No difference

I think I’m over whether it’s good or bad. I agree with you—it just is.

I just don’t think it’s necessary to lock out everyone else because they’ve proven capable of delivering at that point and it opens up all the options instead of letting the defense off the hook by limiting your own self to a single option.

by The Human Highlight Blog on Mar 23, 2010 10:23 AM EDT up reply actions  

yep!

too much JJ not enough team.

by DPhenomenal1 on Mar 23, 2010 10:59 AM EDT up reply actions  

Not with me...

But I understand your point—-I can remember multiple players getting rung up for “deferring” late in games. Kevin Garnett, LeBron, etc.

by The Human Highlight Blog on Mar 23, 2010 10:24 AM EDT up reply actions  

He might get that..

…if he plays us every game the rest of the season!

by The Human Highlight Blog on Mar 23, 2010 10:34 AM EDT up reply actions  

Ben Gordon

got 5/58 and he was 25—-Salmons is 30. Even given the probable buffet of money that teams will have available, it’s not likely that someone is going to give John even 4/60.

by The Human Highlight Blog on Mar 23, 2010 10:58 AM EDT up reply actions  

I can see Salmons being a replacement for Joe's *wink wink* deal.

If John has a great run in the playoffs, teams will get desperate this summer. NBA is not in a recession watch the money thrown around this summer

by one66soul on Mar 23, 2010 11:05 AM EDT up reply actions  

Or just in the playoffs...

one big series, and count the money. Not a Joe sized deal, but maybe one like James Posey got.

And I’m leaning more and more towards replacing Joe with Randy Foye and Chill, draft Gani Lawal or another big man, sign Garrett Siler, and go
Bibby/Teague
Foye/Crawford/Chill
Marvin/Chill
Smooth/Lawal?
Horf/Zaza/Siler

by Mr. Sanchez on Mar 23, 2010 12:09 PM EDT up reply actions  

Good big to work with going forward imo...

you can’t teach 7’, and if he pans out you got a diamond in the rough. If not, you still got a cheap, big body for fouls on the bench.

by Mr. Sanchez on Mar 23, 2010 12:13 PM EDT up reply actions  

Two straight possessions they went

into the post to Josh and it worked, the third time he went to the line or something like that. My memory is a little fuzzy. Anyway, it’s an option that could have been explored a bit more. Al didn’t miss a fg attempt. That’s an option that could have been explored a bit more. The big difference in the Bucks 4th quarter scoring explosion and the Hawks Joe Johnson explosion was ball movement. I’m all for Joe taking over like he did when he has it going, but the Bucks defense figured him out and we didn’t adjust, well we did, but then we decided to let him force the issue anyway. As far as the foul call, it was deserved. He was all over Salmons and Bavetta gave him a few extra seconds of that “aggressiveness”. He’s got to be smarter than that. Salmons wasn’t even in a position to hurt the Hawks at that point. He was damn near at half court. I don’t blame the refs for that one. Joe forced them to make that call.

@cocoqt81

by Co Co on Mar 23, 2010 10:41 AM EDT reply actions  

Fully agree

That was a foul on Salmons. Let’s be real. JJ was all over Salmons on their court for crying out loud. What are the refs supposed to do? Good call by the ref, stupid decision by JJ.

I love JJ, but agree with everything here. There needs to be some type of balance somewhere, and even though JJ was on fire, he would eventually miss. And other teams force him out more and more. This is a pattern.

Unfortunately, it is also a pattern with Hawks, as this game more than anything, reminded me of Toronto all over again, where JJ was not ever there.

by ATLpaul on Mar 23, 2010 11:51 AM EDT up reply actions  

I noticed

his dad in the audience on Sunday. Could this be a factor in his outstanding game? I wonder if his dad could travel with the team because yesterday it was like come on Marvin when are you gonna step up. Marvin took a game off.

by DPhenomenal1 on Mar 23, 2010 11:02 AM EDT up reply actions  

Can we blame Marvin for only getting

two fg attempts? Al, only got 5 and Josh got 9. Marvin is an afterthought in the offense as always and that’s not all his fault. We win and lose on the hands of the guards 85% of the time. That’s just how it is.

@cocoqt81

by Co Co on Mar 23, 2010 11:00 AM EDT reply actions  

It is starting to get really, really annoying

To read people complain about JJ’s offense at the end of games. Al Horford’s offensive game does NOT have enough polish for the final minutes of a game, I don’t care how much you love him. Please stop this.

by Buzzsaw on Mar 23, 2010 11:21 AM EDT reply actions  

Didn't really stop him against SA

Nor Jamal’s games this season. Or Josh Smith in the high post against Utah in Salt Lake City.

I stated above—-it’s beyond discussing good v bad, it just is. When Joe decides it’s time for him to win or lose the game like last night, he makes himself and the result the story—win or lose.

by The Human Highlight Blog on Mar 23, 2010 11:24 AM EDT up reply actions  

That wonderful, we all recognize that JJ's ceiling

makes us a 50+ win team, not a 60+ win team. Once Horford or Smith or Marvin are ready to take over offensively at the end of games, that’s what we are. But I don’t think it’s a bad thing to have a guy that can back his way to within 3 ft of the basket, at will, in the last few minutes of a game. It’s definitely not something to complain about.

by Buzzsaw on Mar 23, 2010 11:30 AM EDT up reply actions  

outside of the last play

i had no problem with Joe’s offense in the fourth. he was owning.

wanting more shots for Al Horford is not necessarily an indictment on Joe but he did shoot the ball five more times than Horf, and Horf never missed.

in some ways, the Bucks came back going 3 for 2 with drive and kicks. and they had a few people make shots in between Salmons makes. should Joe have been shooting down the stretch? last night yes. other nights no. the fact that he does it all the time is a reason for critique because he is only successful so often.

my bigger issue is 5 shots for Horford period. At least one of those was a put back. Joe is the easiest target for that. Well, Woody is the easiest target. Basically, we were going to win if Joe hit about 8 shots in a row. Instead, he hit about six. That is a great showing. But what kind of strategy is it where winning requires 8 makes by one guy?

by hawksdawgs on Mar 23, 2010 11:30 AM EDT up reply actions  

i agree and if you want to go that way

the season says, “the Joe show” is not good. period.

he has won probably four games in the fourth all year (and at least two of those Bucks first game, Charlotte Friday had Joe playing horrible before the fourth). the hawks have lost the fourth far more than that running the same thing.

that is looking big picture.

by hawksdawgs on Mar 23, 2010 11:35 AM EDT up reply actions  

but again

that is not knocking Joe.

Joe was great last night. just great. but I wish Al Horford was getting more shots. And while some nights, those shots should not come from Joe, some nights they should. and every night, the guy with the most usage takes some of the blame for not giving up that usage to very efficient players.

by hawksdawgs on Mar 23, 2010 11:36 AM EDT up reply actions  

Lucky for us...

Our two end game closers skill-sets are designed for big game, end of game shots. With the rest of the team super focused in the playoffs, JJ and Crawford’s shot making will be invaluable. However, it might not be the best skill set to consistently win 4th quarters in the regular season.

by Buzzsaw on Mar 23, 2010 11:38 AM EDT up reply actions  

exactly which is why Joe should be doing what both Lebron and Kobe do which us this time to build up the 4th quarter confidence of your team to counter what you know teams are gonna do in the playoffs .

People remember JJ going for 36 in Boston earlier this year but completely forget that Crawford had 6pts and 1 assists in the last 3 minutes to seal the game .

Everything positive that has happened to us this year has been because weve had multiple people contributing . Everytime we try to let JJ carry us for the entire 4th by himself it ends badly for us . I know the team knows this I guarantee that the numbers are charted yet we still fall back on those old habits .

Right now we should be treating some of these games as if they were playoff situations . I would rather lose by 7 pts with Al,Josh,Marv,Crawford all missing good looks setup by JJ down the stretch than to lose by 3 with everyone standing around watching JJ .

by Hoopforia on Mar 23, 2010 12:05 PM EDT up reply actions  

idk a loss is a loss

in my book

Atlanta will win a championship....someday

by maxxj3 on Mar 23, 2010 12:54 PM EDT up reply actions  

I'm definitely less bitter than most people though...

I’m actually rooting for tight games/OT games in hopes of avoiding the Magic at all costs. Even though the Bucks are hot, a team that has Kurt Thomas and Jerry Stackhouse playing significant minutes is not going to beat the Hawks, it’s like Celtics-lite-lite.

by Buzzsaw on Mar 23, 2010 11:35 AM EDT up reply actions  

I suppose you missed the Spurs game, along with several quarters of other games.

When Al shows for 3 qtrs that the opposing front line can’t guard him only to be ignored by his teammates in the 4th qtr, that doesn’t equate to Al not being polished. He didn’t miss a shot last night, it’s reasonable to assume he should have at least been given the opportunity to continue to outplay the front line he had been outplaying the previous 36 minutes of the game.

@cocoqt81

by Co Co on Mar 23, 2010 11:26 AM EDT reply actions  

By getting ignored in the fourth

Al is turning into the new Dwight Howard

Watching Bobby Cox pick boogers since 1995

by a hooter's baby on Mar 23, 2010 11:34 AM EDT up reply actions  

Milwaukee set the Hawks up!

The Bucks wasn’t double teaming JJ. Why? Because they wanted the Joe Show. Why? Because they knew they couldn’t beat the Hawks as a team. When the Hawks play as a team they are almost unstoppable.

by DPhenomenal1 on Mar 23, 2010 11:32 AM EDT reply actions  

You're right.

It’s like we’re all willing to ignore the fact that the Hawks had a 10 point lead when the game was not all about Joe. That’s where the criticism of the Joe Johnson takeover has merit. Although he was making shots, one could certainly argue that it didn’t need to happen. However, none of that overshadows the fact that our defense was not good in that fourth qtr.

@cocoqt81

by Co Co on Mar 23, 2010 11:40 AM EDT up reply actions  

The team missed 6 free throws = loss

to blame 1 man is absurd, we can break each player on each team after a loss so what, the TEAM WINS, THE TEAMS Loss, With that being said less BASH WOODY!

by one66soul on Mar 23, 2010 11:57 AM EDT reply actions  

Every other star gets blame

Isn’t Joe supposed to be our star? Then yes, he will get blame and he should. The Hawks were winning until it became the Joe show. That’s just the truth.

@cocoqt81

by Co Co on Mar 23, 2010 12:01 PM EDT up reply actions  

There's a difference

between taking over a game out of necessity and taking over a game just because you feel like it. He did the latter.

@cocoqt81

by Co Co on Mar 23, 2010 12:05 PM EDT up reply actions  

nope

Kobe, Wade and Lebron has missed some game winners/shots.

by DPhenomenal1 on Mar 23, 2010 12:10 PM EDT up reply actions  

But

superstars are flawed. Most times when LBJ/KB24 decide to takeover a game their team wins.

When JJ takes over a game sometimes we win, most times we don’t. LOL!

JJ was great but again the JJ show was not necessary. His team mates shots were falling.

by DPhenomenal1 on Mar 23, 2010 12:17 PM EDT up reply actions  

You're missing my point

which is simply the Joe Johnson takeover was not necessary until he made it so.

@cocoqt81

by Co Co on Mar 23, 2010 12:19 PM EDT up reply actions  

+1

the Joe Show threw the teams chemistry off which may or may not have led to the decline in defense.

by DPhenomenal1 on Mar 23, 2010 12:19 PM EDT up reply actions  

agreed

free throws were the end game last night.

by hawksdawgs on Mar 23, 2010 12:04 PM EDT up reply actions  

You can't

SBN for some odd reason refuses to allow editing of comments.

"Big Ten can have this challenge. Duke loses, we all win..."
-Marcus Ginyard, G - UNC

by Jesse28 on Mar 24, 2010 7:32 AM EDT up reply actions  

Killer Instinct

Hawks seem to lack a killer instinct with or without JJ.

We saw this game before in Toronto, carbon copy.
We have seen leads evaporate against golden State, against Orlando.

To me that is sign of a team that is still maturing, and is still has enough doubt, enough cracks in the armor, that other teams can use to rattle us. I am more afraid leading teams, than when it is even going into 4th qtr.

Just as easily as JJ missed shots at the end, one can point at Lion and Smoove missing free throws. Again, the team gets rattled in the 4th. That means, we still have room to grow. Whether with personnel changes or more maturity. We continue to have problems stopping a decent perimeter shooter who becomes a GREAT shooter against us.
Regardless, one more loss, we are still ok, as long as we beat Orlando tomorrow night.

by ATLpaul on Mar 23, 2010 12:01 PM EDT reply actions  

Why was Milwaukee not

double teaming JJ? It had to be part of a game plan. Something. I mean it kinda threw me off.

by DPhenomenal1 on Mar 23, 2010 12:13 PM EDT reply actions  

Funny, not one comment about...

the DNP-CD for Jeff Teague. I thought we might see him for Jennings quickness, but then their rook didn’t play much (or well).

I guess Woody has a rule where Teague doesn’t play at all in two games per month. The sporadic minutes is getting ridiculous. Since the start and near 20 vs. New Jersey, he’s gone 8, 7, 3, 0. Leading into the 20 it was 5, 9, 12. And we wonder why the kid struggles.

by Mr. Sanchez on Mar 23, 2010 12:17 PM EDT reply actions  

This is another reason why I am not mad @ this loss:

the NBA has brainwashed its players & coaches that it is okay to not play hard & win on back 2 back, if I was a coach I would dead this mentality in training camp

by one66soul on Mar 23, 2010 12:20 PM EDT up reply actions  

Joe Smith played well in the first half

What happened to him down the stretch?

Bet it hit the rim!

by dstdeelite on Mar 23, 2010 12:19 PM EDT reply actions  

he aged

Watching Bobby Cox pick boogers since 1995

by a hooter's baby on Mar 23, 2010 12:24 PM EDT up reply actions  

he disappeared into the forest known as benchem

lol, ok that was lame

Atlanta will win a championship....someday

by maxxj3 on Mar 23, 2010 1:00 PM EDT up reply actions  

Hawks scheduling blues

It seems the Hawks repeatedly play rested teams on the back end of back to backs and must travel to boot.Winning teams make their free throws. Where was Marvin Williams last night. Wouldn’t it be nice to have the whole team show up for a whole game ( especially against Orlando )

by D4 on Mar 23, 2010 12:26 PM EDT reply actions  

Let's not kid ourselves

JJ had a really good fourth quarter. And what the result? Hawks still only scored 21 points in it. And that’s despite Josh Smith scoring 5 points on 3 consecutive possessions inside of a minute.

He took 11 shot attempts. 14 points on 11 shot attempts is….decent. It’s not great. He went 5/5 to start the quarter, then 2/6 to end the quarter. Great is something like 12 points on 5 shots, or 32 points on 19 shots. 18 points on 9 shots (that’s Ridnour).

JJ was pretty much able to get anything he wanted against Delfino and Stackhouse. Well, duh. But once he had to try to get it against Salmons or Mbah a Moute, he was much less effective. Taking advantage of good match-ups is a good idea. Thinking that you can’t miss because you’ve taking advantage of the match-up, once the match-up changes, is crazy.

by Bronn on Mar 23, 2010 12:30 PM EDT reply actions  

Jokes

Always trying to blame Joe, what a joke anyone doing that is

by Truthspitter on Mar 23, 2010 6:58 PM EDT reply actions  

Here's a joke for you

Go stand in front of a mirror, point at it, and say, “I’m not stupid, you are!” Repeat until one of you wins.

"Big Ten can have this challenge. Duke loses, we all win..."
-Marcus Ginyard, G - UNC

by Jesse28 on Mar 24, 2010 7:35 AM EDT up reply actions  

lmao

omg

IF YOU CANT ACCEPT LOSING, YOU CANT WIN.

by Hawksgirl on Mar 24, 2010 3:27 PM EDT up reply actions  

Here's a joke for you

I have a lake behind my house full of alligators go play with them, lmao, ha ha ha, he he he

by Truthspitter on Mar 24, 2010 4:43 PM EDT up reply actions  

Ahhh

So cute, but I didn’t know they let the special kids out during the week.

"Big Ten can have this challenge. Duke loses, we all win..."
-Marcus Ginyard, G - UNC

by Jesse28 on Mar 25, 2010 7:32 AM EDT up reply actions  

Comments For This Post Are Closed


User Tools

Welcome to the SB Nation blog about the Atlanta Hawks.

FanPosts

Community blog posts and discussion.

Recent FanPosts

4_sports_small
Obligatory offseason rosterbatory thread.
Bhop_small
Ethical concern for playoffs?
Small
The Most Hated Team in the NBA
Small
Josh Smith trade value.
Small
Avery Bradley: 'I'm ready; I'll be ready in Round 2 as well'
Phimualpha_small
So now...TMac's shot is here
Small
Joe Johnson is subpar in the playoffs... Larry Drew is not helping.
Small
Kevin Garnett on Hawks: ‘A better team since we've seen them'
Small
WIN WIN TRADE
Small
You were wrong

+ New FanPost All FanPosts >


Managers

Zaza_pachulia_small hawksdawgs

Walker_hawks_small Jason Walker

339989_2352026010636_1549728496_32463242_1925189807_o_small Kris Willis

Authors

Str8talk_logo_main_200p_small Hawk Str8Talk

317753_2142423076352_1119450085_31772239_660825236_n_small Nate Butler Jr.

Website_logo_small William Sevidal