Toronto Raptors 106, Atlanta Hawks 105 or Chris Bosh's one second is better than your 47 plus minutes
Go watch the replay. Josh Smith has his hands on his knees as the foul shot goes up. Amir Johnson shoots into the lane and Josh, seemingly forgetting these are some of the last few seconds of effort he needs to try for the night, lurches forward in a frantic move to regain position and pushes the ball out of bounds. The infuriating thing about Josh Smith is not his poor decisions (those are just frustrating) it is his lapses in effort. One can understand ego and lack of discipline for those decisions, poor effort is just inexcusable.
This was going to be a stolen win, the most satisfying win in a long time. Instead, it ends with gnashing teeth over Marvin's dreadful shooting, Josh Smith jump shots, and wasted Mo Evans gems. One more basket by the Hawks, maybe just one more rebound by the Hawks, and Chris Bosh looks like a lot of wasted money tonight. Instead, he leaves the max contract hero. In my mind though, Al Horford outplayed Bosh for every last bit of those 48 minutes. It is just a shame the other four guys on the court for the Hawks were a few points short.
I cannot say Joe Johnson was missed. Not with Maurice Evans 16 highly efficient points and decent defense. We all know Joe is no fast break stopper, and that is where Atlanta truly lost the game. Still, Atlanta was simply not patience enough on a few key possessions down the stretch. With under 35 seconds left, Jamal went to feed Horford in the post and after no more than a second, Jamal could not stand running a real play and he drove the baseline. A few passes later, Josh Smith missed a runner in the lane. The next time the Hawks got the ball back was with two seconds to go. Atlanta does not normally need patience down the stretch. They give the ball to a guard and spread the floor. Tonight, they had the opportunity to do something different and realized they don't know how.
Go Hawks!
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this game hurt like Golden State
just “ouch!”, Nothing else to say.
The future has come...in the form of Jason Heyward.
Big Whoop
Glad Joe got the rest. Easily could have won by ten, but you know…some people still want to chop wood with a butter knife when they have chain saw right next to them. I don’t know what Josh’s beef is, but he better grill it up and eat it so his attitude won’t spread to the other teammates. I still want to know who is the real player leader in the locker room. Or who can be?
Atlanta will win a championship....someday
ok, let me just say this
It appears the hawks are still too young to grasp the big picture of what they can do this year. I believe one major reason Joe is needed on this team is to supply consistency on the court. Now he may not have the moxie to be a outspoken charismatic leader but his consistency speaks for him. I haven’t seen yet what Lebron does for his team or Dwight does for his team or Chauncey, Kobe, Nash, or Wade does for their respective teams, in the hawks team this year. I want to see. I hope to see it soon
Atlanta will win a championship....someday
They'll have to show me proof Marvin was out of bounds when he tapped that ball in.
Unbelievable. Moving on….Charlotte is next. I hate playing them about as much as Orlando. Go Hawks!!
Bet it hit the rim!
Zero-wing only had 8 minutes?
Way to go Black Kojak.
You coulda started Teague, or even played him double-digit minutes, to show that you still trust him and plan to develop the guy.
Instead you give the rook just 8 minutes.
And the only bench player not named Jamal to gets double-digit minutes is Zaza, with 11.
Way to use your bench, Babe!
Marvin for Mo was a bad move
Near the end when Woody brought Marvin in for Mo, that was a bad move. Marvin is like a dead man walking, a Zombie, who knows what he is thinking, Always smiling and kissing up with the opponents. He has no consistent outside jumper as a small forward. And his moves to basket are a joke. Of-course we have him for 5 more years, thanks to old Sund.
Yep, we saw how much better he plays without JJ in there. if i am Woody, i sit him down for next game. He responds better to a spanking than love.
Good wrap up.
The real issue was likely playing a back-to-back again, because the Raps only had four turnovers the whole night. Four!
They took five more shots than the Hawks.
22 assists
12 of them came via 2 front court players. For one, 22 assists on 41 made baskets isn’t a great ratio-it’s fairly average. But generally, guards are supposed to be distributors, not the bigs, but we had such an easy time getting bigs into a position detrimental to the defense that they were able to dominate will ball movement. They had it so easy that no one else tried very hard to get a quality shot.
This makes the last five minutes completely bewildering. Here’s what happened (this is obviously long).
At 5:00, Hawks lead 99-90, following a Horford made basket.
At 4:42 Bargnani gets fouled and makes 1 Free throw. 99-91.
On the next possession, great ball movement is ruined by crappy spacing (one might call it Iso spacing). Crawford and Horford set a pick and roll, but there’s no one near the basket. Horford catches in a great position, but the defense collapses in on him. He passes cross-court to Marvin who flips it to Josh Smith, who stood at the three point line the entire possession and naturally took the open 21 footer. Miss. Two Raptors block out Horford while a third secures the rebound-no one else was close.
Next possession, at 4:13, DeRozan is fouled on a drive by Marvin. Again, only one made FT and it’s 99-92.
The next possession doesn’t do anything until Jamal gets the ball isolated at the top of the key with 10 seconds left on the shotclock. Again, crappy spacing, with no one in a position to rebound, but it doesn’t matter as Crawford hits a 22 footer. 101-92
The next possession is entirely on Josh. He’s standing around watching, so his man-Bargnani-just slips from the 3 point line past where Josh is stationed at the free throw line to catch an open lay-up at the basket. Josh effectively guarded no one on that possession, and didn’t even hustle to attempt to make it up once he realized his error. 101-94.
Keep in mind, now, it’s a 3 possession game with 3:30 left at this point.
Bibby dribbles it slowly up the court, passes to Crawford with 14 on the shot clock. Crawford puts on a dribbling display, doesn’t look for any better shot, and heaves a three up with no one in a position to block out with 4 left on the shot clock. No attempt to find a big.
Toronto gets a phantom transition 3. Once again, no one deigns to guard Bargnani, a good shooter, at the 3 point line. Part of this is because the Hawks didn’t have a chance to set the defense, and Bibby was on Bosh while Horford was on Derozan as the ball was pushed up the court, so Josh cheats toward Bargnani who is left totally open. 101-97 with 2:50 left.
This time the Hawks clearly had a plan. Gave it Horford posting up Bargnani from about 18 feet, and he turns and drives straight in for 2. Good shot. 103-97. And Horf nearly steals the inbound pass too as it’s lazily delivered.
Next possession is a bad switch. Marvin switches onto Bosh who gets into a good position and is fouled before he can ever even catch the pass, while Horf is out on Turkoglu. Bosh makes both, and then it’s 103-99 with 2:20 remaining.
At this point, we’re clearly force feeding Horf. First he’s handed the ball off outside the perimeter, which clearly isn’t a good position, so there’s a quick reset to post him up from about 18 feet, and Bosh fouls him. On the out of bounds, Horf is clearly establishing post position against Bosh again, but for some reason, the ball goes in to Crawford instead, who gives to Josh in the high post. Josh tries to drive through a double team (doesn’t dish out to a wide open Marvin in the corner) and loses the ball.
On the transition, Jamal does a great job of picking up Weems, then comes out to cover Turkoglu when he passes out. But Weems gets the ball back wide open as Bibby fails to pick up anyone at any point, so Weems sinks the deuce, 103-101.
(At this point, you’ll notice that bad offense seems to be leading to transition baskets).
Okay, clearly the problem with the previous play was the failure to get Horford the ball when he finds a good post position. So Horford establishes himself once again, and spins off to sink a nifty hook shot. 105-101, 1:37 left.
Coming back, Toronto wants to isolate Bosh on Horford for some reason. The Hawks comply, and Horford swats the shot and gets the rebound with 1:22 left.
Afterward, the Hawks clearly want to run some clock, so Jamal stands out at halfcourt dribbling until the shotclock gets to about 10 without making a serious move. Horford once against attempts to establish a good post position, but he’s forced out way too high given the amount of time. No one else is inside the 3 point stripe anywhere. Horf hands the ball back out to Jamal for an open three. It’s rush, but a decent look. What makes THIS possession bad is Jamal gets his shot up, and there’s 4 green jerseys closer to the basket than any single white jersey. Turkoglu, Bargnani, and Calderon-not one of those guys was forced to actually guard someone on this possession. WAY too much standing around. Calderon gets the rebound with 58 seconds left, timeout.
Toronto then runs another Bosh iso. Josh Smith gets switched onto him and, well…he let him face-up, which was the problem. Josh actually plays him well, but he’s not great at cutting off guys with lateral quickness, which gives Bosh the separation he needs to get up his shot. 105-103, 45 seconds left.
Keep in mind-Horford has scored 6 out of the last eight points. One the 3 other possessions where he’s touched the ball, he 1) broke down the defense resulting in Josh Smith catching the ball wide open from 23 feet, 2) drew a Chris Bosh foul, and 3) created a good open look for Jamal. What do the Hawks do here?
Apparently, the plan was for Jamal to drive into a bad baseline angle. He does a nifty job of finding Bibby open, but the pass isn’t crisp enough for Bibby to get a shot up. Horford asks for the ball. It goes to Marvin. Horford asks for the ball. It goes to Josh, who immediately drives and then complains about no foul being called. 1) This is the second bad drive by Josh inside the 5 minute mark, and it also marks 3 ill-advised shots in which the best move was clearly to pass it. Horford, the man who’s created all your offense over the past 5 minutes, does not touch the ball.
We know what happened from there. Bosh iso, fade-away, and then a Jamal heave.
As for that MArvin out of bounds call
It’s too close for me to tell on DVR. He clearly was in bounds, then tries to hop backwards while tapping the ball back over to Horford. I’m not sure if his right foot came down before he managed to tap the ball back or not. It’s really close either way.
I've made a bunch o' people mad at me over this kind of stuff, but i really think it's impossible to ignore.
This kind of late-game f-up—ignoring the guy who has been money—is what happens to teams who have no hierarchy.
I cannot think of a single good team that does not have a clear guy to get the ball to in late-game situations (though there may be some I am forgetting, but I think even Boston had to sort out that Pierce was the man at the game’s end). Even if that guy sometimes screws up, the chances of getting at least a foul call on a star player are just so much better than almost anything the other second-tier guys can do.
the Hawks have a go-to guy. his name is Joe, and the Hawks still have squandered fourth quarter leads of late. and he NEVER gets the superstar call. Al and Josh get to the line far more often, and with greater usage, have games that would get them there even more.
you cannot possibly say “see none of these other guys is a go to guy” because of one game when
1. one of them was a go to guy, Horford.
2. the team is not set up nor has it ever practiced one of them being so.
it is not a question of ending the debate over whether Josh or Al can be the go to guy. it is saying this game showed no evidence that at least Al cannot. and even if both were horrible, it would be like making a judgment on Teague over his one start. yes, Al and Josh play a lot more minutes and we know their game a lot better, but they so rarely have been asked or given the chance to make shots down the stretch. the point is Josh and Al are far more efficient at scoring and as good at getting their teammates involved as Joe. When the defense tightens and double teams come, can they rise up and still get points? I don’t know. But Al DID last night. With an actual game plan, an offense that runs through those guys on a regular basis, and practice being that guy, it could easily work. I am not saying it will work, but coming on here, saying “see this is problem with Al Horford” after last night makes little sense.
the issue was perimeter defense, lazy effort, and transition play. that has little to do with an alpha dog on offense.
are fourth quarter buckets a valid concern without Joe?
Yes. Can anyone definitively say Horford and Josh could not be that guy?
No.
Is Joe Johnson an efficient fourth quarter scorer now?
No.
Are Josh and Al still getting better?
Yes.
Boy, Al did put on a show in that 4th quarter
Too bad they canceled it before we got to see the finale.
by The Human Highlight Blog on Mar 18, 2010 10:25 AM EDT up reply actions
Clarification:
I fully recognize Joe Johnson’s limitations as a go-to guy. He does not get to the line, like you say. He does not pass out of double-and triple-teams well enough. He often forces bad shots.
I submit, however, that Al’s performance last night was a product of the team they were playing and (wow) taking advantage of matchups (can this really have been true?). The problem is that late in the game all of the players in the NBA recognize the unwritten rule about the alpha dog taking the big shot. When the team doesn’t have clarity on that, several players can seem to think THEY are the one to take the shot. Jamal Crawford thinks this, without a doubt. He thinks HE is Mr. Big Shot…I steadfastly disagree, because he rarely makes those or even gets a good shot, but watch JC when he is in at the end of a quarter or a close game. He ain’t passing.
I have seen one exception to the alpha-dog thing in the NBA, and that is with Larry Brown’s teams. Brown coaches match-up discipline when the team c an have it (exception with Iverson). THAT is why I think the Hawks should get him as coach, even though I don’t think his style really works for contending in the NBA (I submit his only 1 title as evidence). It might work here. It would certainly make the Hawks better and get them more wins.
I'm sorry to seem so negative.
But I do see the flaws everyone else sees and I think we all know the team faces a real crossroads in the off-season.
High Post/Low Post
Smith has been extremely effective in the high post in games and has a great High-Low chemistry with Horford. The Hawks don’t have the superstar to do the Kobe-LeBron-Jordan thing, so they have to go the same route that other quality teams have had to do over the years to get good shots late.
by The Human Highlight Blog on Mar 18, 2010 10:29 AM EDT up reply actions
one problem with Josh in the high post
late in games, I can remember three times recently where teams played way off him and he shot the jumper.
i am all for seeing high post/low post late in games, but that has to be a benchable offense in crunch time.
Good point
But when they do that Josh has to be disciplined enough to attack that gap and get to the line, create another shot for Al, etc. His presence out there really stretches the defense and creates excellent space.
by The Human Highlight Blog on Mar 18, 2010 10:36 AM EDT up reply actions
My opinion on Joe
is that of Josh and Jamal need to be coached into late-game discipline than Joe may be able to as well. This is another reason I support Brown as coach—I think he gets Joe to fix his flaws.
And if Joe's flaws
are fixed i think the sky is the limit for the next two years, personally.
Too bad--
Joe is going to want four more years after those two. Can we hypnotize him to taking a 2-year deal? :-)
by The Human Highlight Blog on Mar 18, 2010 12:00 PM EDT up reply actions
No, the problem was
Josh Smith was standing stationary outside of the three point line, and the Hawks never attempted to get Josh Smith established in the high post.
The big failing I’m pointing is not only that we didn’t get Horford the ball in good positions, but that the offense completely stopped running plays. It was Iso-horf (which was generally working) but with no help for him to get a rebound or a outlet pass.
If we could bring in Jim Harrick to teach this team offense...
it’d be amazing. He ran the Wooden high post to perfection, and it’d be ideal for Josh and Al.
by Mr. Sanchez on Mar 18, 2010 11:25 AM EDT up reply actions
I know right?
I mean, we have been in the top of the league offensively all year. Imagine how much better it could be if we had a coach who thought something other than that the offense will take care of itself. We wouldn’t have to worry as much about our defensive deficiencies because we would be scoring more, and more efficiently.
"Big Ten can have this challenge. Duke loses, we all win..."
-Marcus Ginyard, G - UNC
Larry Brown had an alpha dog at the end of a game...
and he went by “Mr. Big Shot”.
by Mr. Sanchez on Mar 18, 2010 11:24 AM EDT up reply actions
What's the use of having a "go-to" guy if 90% of the time he doesn't deliver?
My question is why should a team limit themselves to 1 “go to guy?” You’re at a disadvantage when they know you’re going to that one main guy. I also would argue that JC is Mr. Big Shot. Go look at youtube and tell me how many game winners Jamal has had compared to Joe. Don’t get me wrong I like Joe. I wish he’d stay. He and Jamal make an awesome tandem, but closing games is not typically his thing. He’s very consistent throughout the game, but when it’s crunch time, JC is tried and true. If all else fails, he can get to the rim AND draw contact better than anybody else on our roster. I just think we have options on this team. I can’t think of one other team in the league that’s constructed with a starting sharp shooter coming off the bench. The Jet, IMO, is not even close.
Bet it hit the rim!
uh i think Jamal has been getting...
the chances to take the last shot, to close out games as of late even when JJ is playing. Of course its better to have options, that’s why you have to keep JJ. Jamal has hit some clutch three pointers, but you have to admit it there’s only one three pointer he’s actually won the game by.
Atlanta will win a championship....someday
Yeah 1 game won for the Hawks....I was talking throughout Jamal's career
Seriously, I’ve looked at countless game winners on youtube from this guy. Some guys have a knack for those pressure situations. He just happens to be one of them. No knock on JJ. He’s Mr. Reliable. You know what you’re gonna get from him on a nightly basis. Unless, of course, Joe Freakin Johnson suits up.
Bet it hit the rim!
Throughout Jamal's career
he has proven his ability as a number 1 guy. The record speaks for itself, dee, just as you say. His number of games played on winning teams speaks volumes.
Keep it up
Keep up all your sideways Joe bashing but when he leaves and you are 35-47 again and back in lottery I will remind you of it over and over again, because if you can’t beat a team as soft as the Raptors without Joe, he is truly missed.
JJ is missed
no doubt about that. You can not miss a 4 time all star and not miss his quality. But Hawks played well enough to win, mental lapses and other items got to us again. I am glad NCAAs are here today, i can drown myself in that and forget
I agree
Watched a lot of college b-ball lately, Mississippi State is my favorite team being that I graduated from there and I think Stansbury is a horrible coach, which made me back off of my leave Woody alone stance. I think Stansbury is better than Woody in some ways and that is really really a bad sign Woody.
by Truthspitter on Mar 18, 2010 8:26 AM EDT up reply actions
So now every players effort is a by-product of JJ being on the court?
I think not. This game wasn’t lost because JJ wasn’t playing. It was lost because of the other players not putting forth effort defensively when it mattered most and bad offensive sets. There is no correlation between that and JJ at all.
So, as long as you continue to type untruths every time you comment, I will continue to call you on it.
"Big Ten can have this challenge. Duke loses, we all win..."
-Marcus Ginyard, G - UNC
Dude please
If the Hawks can’t beat the softest team in the NBA without Joe, there future is certainly lottery without Joe. So, you and the rest of your clueless blogging friends can keep on with the Joe bashing, but I will bring it up every loss on the way to the lottery next year and I promise
by Truthspitter on Mar 18, 2010 8:29 AM EDT up reply actions
Because without Joe next year...
the Hawks will have the exact same roster we saw last night, right?
by Mr. Sanchez on Mar 18, 2010 10:11 AM EDT up reply actions
Basically
Correct, prove otherwise? You can only claim that it will be different but with a stupid management that signs Marvin “the Bust” Williams to a long term contract then what sensible person will believe that things will be different?
by Truthspitter on Mar 18, 2010 10:44 AM EDT up reply actions
the Hawks have a draft pick
they could sign and trade joe.
they could trade jamal’s expiring contract. They could trade any player actually.
they will have a few million under the cap, and i think they have the full mid-level exception.
roster could look very different.
Because if we lose Joe...
and Mo’s contract expires, it makes sense that Sund would likely sign a SG to compete for the starting job, either allowing Crawford to stay in his highly productive 6th man role, or become that 6th man themselves. Guys like Ray Allen, Randy Foye, Rudy Gay, Josh Howard, Anthony Morrow, Ronnie Brewer, Raja Bell, and countless others. Are you really this stupid to think we’d let Joe walk and enter next year with Bibby, Teague, Crawford, Mo, Marvin, Smooth, Horf, and Zaza? You can argue they’d sign a bad player to a bigger than they deserve deal (like you imply with Marvin), but to think they’d let Joe walk, resign Mo, and let that ride is retarded. I’m surprised you can spell and use the internets at that level of idiocy.
by Mr. Sanchez on Mar 18, 2010 11:20 AM EDT up reply actions
truthspitter
so where were you when the hawks were playing well, like the past 2 games. you can’t bring yourself to say something nice about them, can you? or maybe you were in the celtics blog where you truly belong.
The Hawks were perfectly able to lose to bad, soft teams (Golden State, Knicks, etc.) when Joe was healthy. Last night wasn’t about Joe. It was about a Hawks team that thought the game only lasted 43 minutes and took the last 5 minutes off and stopped doing what had gotten them a comfortable lead.
Exactly
Lie-spitter, way to completely ignore the win over the Nets w/o JJ. Way to completely ignore the losses to the teams mentioned above w/ JJ, some of which can be directly attributed to JJ himself.
I’m sure Miss St. is proud to have you represent them.
"Big Ten can have this challenge. Duke loses, we all win..."
-Marcus Ginyard, G - UNC

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