A brief word on match ups, playoffs, and trades
The Hawks are, at worst, meeting every single fan's preseason expectations this year. If you were looking for more than 52 wins and the second or third seed in the East, you were a bit overly optimistic, and obviously smarter than me. Because I am all for readjusting expectations mid-season to your preseason wisdom. There is no reason to be "ok" with a competitive second round series and call it a season. Everyone should want an Eastern conference finals birth. At this point, we should hope for one (and I mean "hope" in the most expectant way possible). But talk about getting there only if we get a center seems a bit too much like the crib is empty and the baby and the bathwater are hanging out together outside and the baby is cold.
A few things on this matter. The Hawks have the personnel now to beat every team in the league. Maybe not in a seven game series, but also, in a seven game series. The ball will have to bounce the other team's way to beat Atlanta. In Cleveland, there was a shot clock malfunction and a miracle three. That is the definition of the ball bouncing one way. I am not saying Atlanta is better than the Cavs, just that, as currently constructed, they can be better on any given night. And anyone thinking the Hawks can retool the roster so that we are guaranteed to be better four out of seven nights does not understand how good LeBron James is. With LeBron, no guarantee is possible. Closer to better? Sure, but the reoccurring question will be at what cost?
As far as Orlando goes, the match up is bad for the Hawks. Clearly. The only positive perspective I can put on it is the Magic have played some of their best basketball against Atlanta. That is a bit too much spit shine on a turd for some of you, but it should throw out the idea that winning against Orlando is impossible.
I agree the Hawks could use more size down low to go against Shaq and Howard (really just Howard), size that has some semblance of controllable body fat and offensive skill, but I am not willing to give up a major piece to do it. While the Hawks remain undermanned against one specific team, they over man most other teams exactly because of the pieces in place. Trading a Marvin or a Zaza could seriously put into question a few other wins this season or in the playoffs. Not to mention the long term implications for the team.
If the Hawks make a move, it will probably be for an expiring contract. Those teams don't give up free money like that for crap. They just don't. Teams want to shed salary and the Hawks don't have expiring contracts to give. Which means you have to give up serious talent. You want Brendan Haywood? Expect to hear a high price counter offer. If other teams get desperate, maybe they gift wrap something, but I doubt it.
In the end, Atlanta is not Boston, the window does not close this year. Shoot, the window just opened this year. I am not one to over estimate how long one has a window, and with no superstar, it can be a short one, but mortgaging futures to get back up centers just in case we face Orlando seems a bit much.
The Hawks need to win now. Like tomorrow. And then the next day. Keep winning, and I am wiling to take on anyone in the playoffs. I am not going to be excited about Orlando, but honestly, I am not that excited about facing any good teams. You know why? Because they are good. If we can find a trade that lets us face Toronto four times, I am in. Until then, giving up major pieces for possible playoff match ups is not a good long term strategy, and it may not even be a good short term strategy.
Go Hawks!
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Totally agree!
Cleveland went out and go Shaq for that because they felt they were right on the verge of winning a championship, but what are they going to do next year? Who’s going to fill that void when Shaq can barely stand upright? Boston is dealing with similar issues now. They got the Big 3. Granted, it worked out the first year it was assembled,but now they’re barely meeting expectations as the “Beast of the East.” Along with size, I think chemistry goes a long way in a teams success.
I agree with this post word for word
Why ship off core pieces that are important for ONE team. We compete with Cleveland and even the lakers on any given night. I would rather have a bench than a legit center. we win games with the core we have and bench we have. shipping them off for ONE team is not a good enough excuse. Not to mention I love the heart of our lion. He is great to watch.
by Hawksgirl on Feb 1, 2010 9:13 AM EST via mobile reply actions
My favorite line
“In the end, Atlanta is not Boston, the window does not close this year. Shoot, the window just opened this year.”
That’s why I haven’t been here or anywhere else proposing any crazy trades. I don’t want to give up one of our core pieces. It could be because I have an unhealthy attachment to them because I feel like we’ve grown up together. I don’t know, but I do know they all have a purpose on this particular team and I’m worried if you move one of the seemingly least important pieces i.e. Marv or Za Za it will throw everything out of whack. (for the record I don’t view Marv or Za Za as unimportant, but judging by the comments on this site some people disagree). I found myself at a party on Saturday night ferociously defending Mike Bibby and his poor play. He serves a purpose on this team was pretty much my argument. I’m still extremely confident in the team right now. They’re still going to have games that make me want to bang my head against the wall, but hell whose team doesn’t have those games?
i put those two guys in there to keep it realistic on our end who we would "stretch" to give up
i actually think is unrealistic that a team with a legit trading piece would give them up for Zaza defintitely and maybe marvin. draft picks would be tossed in at minimum.
The Hawks just are not in a good position to trade. No huge expiring contract like Big Z and the Cavs.
I think Za Za
and his ridiculously reasonable contract is an asset, but again I don’t think you’re going to do much better than him at the backup center position. Also, the fans would riot if we traded Za Za. I honestly believe that.
as you should
i have a pile of rocks in my craw space just in case he ever gets traded and ensuing riot starts.
definently true
I still consider our least important players core pieces because they do the little things that matter. and you don’t realize how important those things are until their gone. that brings me to jj, he makes me want to kill him some nights Bt when he doesn’t play you realize how important he is which Isaac why I always argue about any trade options for him…………….
by Hawksgirl on Feb 1, 2010 9:43 AM EST via mobile up reply actions
I agree.
I think its more important right now to figure out how to use the pieces we have in the best possible way rather than disrupt our team’s core, which has been together for a few years now. Woodson has done a decent (not great) job of doing that but I would like to see him play some other players a bit more in certain situations.
It is interesting to always hear people come onto the comments section to demand trades whenever we have a loss to Orlando or Cleveland. We can beat Cleveland if we stop choking in the last 5 minutes of the game and don’t allow the refs a chance to give LeBron a chance to travel his way to a win. Orlando is tougher but I still think that we have enough talent to beat them. Our game plan (which is 90% a product of the coaching staff) must be different and we need to play them not on the back end of an outrageous back-to-back featuring Boston and Orlando.
The last 6 times were not on back to backs after facing Boston
I just don’t see ATL beating Orlando 4 times in a 7 game series…
"Memphis then used a pick-and-roll to get Conley free and he drove past Shaquille O'Neal for the go-ahead layup."
Wolves and …
Two days after the wolves were snapping at out Lion’s feet, I can see the bright of day better. With that,
No one in their right mind would want to break the core of the Hawks. That is what gives us our identity. That is what reminds us of those dark days when the nights were long and the losses plenty. Heck I went into depression (and still am) losing Childress. Josh/Marvin/Lion are the core. JJ is the superstar and Jamal is a freak. Those are untouchables. Zaza, ahh Zaza, some nights I can strangle him. Some nights he fights like the tough guy we need. But if there is one I am willing to part with, it be him and a combination of couple other bench players/draft picks. Yes let the rocks come my way HawksDawgs. Not sure that is enough to get a quality big man any way (now that mind is working clearer!!!) but Sund has to earn his paycheck somehow! Signing Mario doesn’t count towards him earning his pay.
Why trade, well here are the facts after the Orlando game:
Orlando outscored our starting frontline 52-27, outrebounded our front line 27-12. What does that mean? I don’t think this result is an accident. Particularly when you look more into details of those numbers. The Lion Horf had only 4 points and a handful of rebounds. Barnes of Orlando also had 4 points. So the majority of difference has to do with the muscle man’s performance against the Lion/Zaza/Jason. Lion took it inside, he tried, but his shots were altered and the muscle man was all over rebounding like a mad man. Muscleman will not move away from the basket, unless he is pushed by a defensive strongman, or he needs to focus on a real threat when he is defending. That is why we need a strong man.
But if my synopsis of Orlando vs. Hawks is true relative to big men, why do we play better vs. Cavs. Why? They are slow!!! They are big, but slow!!! So our guys can overcome some of their size disadvantages with speed. But big size always gives us trouble no matter where we see it. Trades should never be out of question, meanwhile, we have to live with Joe Grand Daddy Smith and our version of Rocky as backups to lion fighting the wolves.
My depression after the loss is improving, here is to revenge against the Thunder :) Go Hawks
Orlando Magic Fan here-
I wouldn’t blow the Hawks up. A lot of team’s have trouble matching up with Dwight. He’s a matchup nightmare. I don’t really see a lot of guys who can match up with him. It’s not worth mortgaging the cohesiveness of the team per chance you play the Magic in the playoffs.
The Hawks are fun to watch and we have a nice little rivalry. It’s only a matter of time until ya’ll get a few wins against us and it really heats up.
Good luck the rest of the year.
by The Stan 'Stache on Feb 1, 2010 7:00 PM EST reply actions
ok
You know, I guess a lot of us, including me, were in panic mode and wanted the hawks to make a serious run at the title this year. Dealing for anybody significant would cost us a piece that we would need later on. But I have to say that every championship team has traded for a substantial piece for a championship run. Also, we have to know a change could be made to the team, within the team, by the team for the forseeable future.
Look, we all say the same things when we lose: We didn’t pass enough, we didn’t drive enough, we didn’t use our bench, we need a big man. It’s pretty clear we all see the same things from a fan perspective about how our team is compared to the championship calibur teams. I hope we don’t lose our core, but I hope the hawks will win a championship someday.
Atlanta will win a championship....someday
Disagree
No sensible person ever suggested you blow up team for Haywood. Giving Zaza and a future 1 is far from blowing up team IMO. Haywood would bring nightly consistency not just once every 10 games. Maybe you don’t even have to give Zaza. Maybe you can give Collins, Evans, and future 1, and that 1 could be 2013. There are ways to get things done. People here seem to have ties to certain players and not winning. I agree team should not be blown up, but if you say trade Zaza there is a big thread. On the other hand, if you say trade Joe or let him walk at the end of the season there are a bunch of reasons why it could be a good move. Good day people.
what are the possibilities of david lee trade?
if the hawks traded for david lee, i wouldnt mind that too much
us taking on eddie curry's contract and giving up joe johnson
all new york wants is to dump salary and get expiring deals. they will not take on contracts. joe is our only expiring deal.
There is the nagging fear that JJ leaves and we get nothing in return.
If we had to sign JJ for a max contract to get him to stay will there be enough money left over to pay Jamal and Al next year. With a shrinking cap and poor attendance it seems like we will have problems.
Are my fears overblown?
I think the basic point
is that you shouldn’t blow up your whole team just to try to beat one team. Cleveland has not blown up their team, but they always make moves to counter whomever eliminated them the year before. They game planned for Boston last year and got Orlando, they’ve game planned for Orlando this year, but who knows who they’ll end up against. You can’t be too reactionary. We might not even play Orlando in the post season.
ok
I’m getting of the trade block bang wagon(what a good for a band!) I think if we stick with our guns, the only choice is to watch them play Orlando in March and see what they do against them. It’s the last game of the season series vs Orlando and It’ll be at home so hopefully “the sh*t works” this time.
Atlanta will win a championship....someday

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